[New-Poetry] Re: New-Poetry Digest, Vol 51, Issue 37
David Baratier
editor at pavementsaw.org
Wed Sep 24 12:09:45 EDT 2008
Be well
David Baratier, Editor
Pavement Saw Press
321 Empire Street
Montpelier OH 43543
http://pavementsaw.org
Subscribe to our e-mail listserv at
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--- On Wed, 9/24/08, new-poetry-request at wiz.cath.vt.edu <new-poetry-request at wiz.cath.vt.edu> wrote:
> From: new-poetry-request at wiz.cath.vt.edu <new-poetry-request at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Subject: New-Poetry Digest, Vol 51, Issue 37
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 12:54 PM
> Send New-Poetry mailing list submissions to
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Re: poetics is childish (Roger Day)
> 2. Maginnes Daily (Jeff Newberry)
> 3. Re: Maginnes Daily (AlMaginnes at aol.com)
> 4. Re: Backwards poetry (Rsgwynn1 at cs.com)
> 5. Re: Backwards poetry (David Weinstock)
> 6. Re: Backwards poetry (Judy Prince)
> 7. Re: Backwards poetry (Rsgwynn1 at cs.com)
> 8. Re: Backwards poetry (Bernadette Geyer)
> 9. Re: Maginnes Daily (TheOldMole)
> 10. Re: Backwards poetry (Jeff Newberry)
> 11. Re:Maginnes Daily (David Graham)
> 12. Re: Re:Maginnes Daily (AlMaginnes at aol.com)
> 13. Re: Backwards poetry (AlMaginnes at aol.com)
> 14. Re: Re: poetics is childish (Halvard Johnson)
> 15. Re: [Backwards poetry (David Graham)
> 16. Re: Re: [Backwards poetry (AlMaginnes at aol.com)
> 17. Re: Backwards poetry (Halvard Johnson)
> 18. Backwards poetry (David Graham)
> 19. Re: Backwards poetry (AlMaginnes at aol.com)
> 20. Backwards poetry (David Graham)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 11:17:07 +0100
> From: "Roger Day" <rog3r.day at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Re: poetics is childish
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> &, Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <fde503480809240317m55b0a25h48530f7424a11118 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Lst night as I was perusing my art books, I began to pull
> away from
> this reductionist view, to move towards a more connected
> view, the
> artwork as a beast that moves across all genres, and
> instantiates
> itself according to the context it finds itself in at the
> time. It
> could appear in several genres. Or none.
>
> On 9/24/08, Roger Day <rog3r.day at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Evolving from this, bearing in mind that poetry has
> to compete with
> > other genres these days, I took Hirst's lead and
> wondered what was
> > unique to Poetry? What distinguishs poetry from the
> other art-forms
> > out there? This is my question.
> >
> > Poetry for me is a unique compression of sound,
> semantics and graphic
> > (text). Take away one of those legs and it begins to
> fail.
> >
> >
> > Roger
> >
> >
> > On 9/23/08, Chris Stroffolino
> <cstroffo at earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > Don't know which question you mean off-hand
> Roger,
> > > but if you're asking about the history of
> narrative poetry,
> > > I do understand why many say that the rise of
> the novel as a separate genre
> > > (to say nothing of other non-poetic narrative)
> definitely coincided with a
> > > lessening of narrative poetry.
> > > The other, somewhat overlapping issue, is the
> rise of "free" (or
> > > non-rhyming) verse...
> > > If poetry no longer rhymes for most, and
> there's short stories and even
> > > short short stories, etc.,
> > > it's understandable why many find
> "narrative poetry" an endangered
> > > species...
> > >
> > > On Sep 22, 2008, at 1:43 PM, Roger Day wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > I agree with you. But I was also wondering
> what you might describe as
> > > > poetry's unique point compared with
> other genres?
> > > >
> > > > Seeing as most of you are content to take
> pot-shots, rather than
> > > > answer that question, here's Nick
> Laird's attempt at an answer:
> > > >
> > > >
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2008/sep/20/poetry
> > > >
> > > > Roger
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 6:50 PM,
> <JforJames at aol.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > In a message dated 9/22/2008 7:36:30
> AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > > > > rog3r.day at gmail.com writes:
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm contesting the question
> > > > > as to what genre narrative is best
> suited to.
> > > > >
> > > > > Photography made quite a few modes of
> painting redundant. Indeed,
> > > > > Damien Hirst in praise of Gerhard
> Richter in the Guardian at the
> > > > > weekend, said that all that is left to
> painting is it's surface. And
> > > > > that's a lot of painting to fall
> by the wayside.
> > > > >
> > > > > To go on telling stories in poetry
> means something else once other
> > > > > similar modes in other genres are up
> for comparison. In other words,
> > > > > what is unique about poetry? To me,
> it's the use of parameters to
> > > > > pattern words across the page, most
> usefully done as a collage. You
> > > > > see, there are techniques other than
> narrative.
> > > > >
> > > > > Roger, I don't know think I'll
> take my notions of art criticism from
> > > Damien
> > > > > Hirst.
> > > > > He certainly couldn't tell Richter
> anything about painting...surface,
> > > > > texture, content,
> > > > > concept, or otherwise. Saying that all
> that is left painting is surface,
> > > is
> > > > > as much saying
> > > > > that the window to the universe is
> still there, waiting, open, blank, a
> > > > > plane in space ready for
> > > > > anything.
> > > > >
> > > > > There is a whole generation of
> photo-realists doing quite well in art
> > > world,
> > > > > 100+ years
> > > > > after the advent of photography. And,
> of course, lot of photography is
> > > > > completely abstract,
> > > > > so the a mechanical means of image
> capture has become just another
> > > medium.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think poetry is
> necessarily the best genre for narrative. It's
> > > still
> > > > > a very good
> > > > > means for the 'telling scene',
> a view into or way of imaginatively
> > > unfolding
> > > > > a larger,
> > > > > untold story.
> > > > > Finnegan
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ________________________________
> > > > > Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial challenges?
> > > Check
> > > > > out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and calculators.
> > > > >
> _______________________________________________
> > > > > New-Poetry mailing list
> > > > > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > > > >
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> > > > "I began to warm and chill
> > > > to objects and their fields"
> > > > Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
> > > >
> _______________________________________________
> > > > New-Poetry mailing list
> > > > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > > >
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> > > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > New-Poetry mailing list
> > > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > >
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> > "I began to warm and chill
> > to objects and their fields"
> > Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
> >
>
>
> --
> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> "I began to warm and chill
> to objects and their fields"
> Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 08:11:59 -0400
> From: "Jeff Newberry"
> <jeff.newberry at gmail.com>
> Subject: [New-Poetry] Maginnes Daily
> To: NewPoetry <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <731bb17a0809240511n503152ddrff79fb48c9b6cf2b at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Today, Verse Daily features a fine poem by our very own Al
> Maginnes.
>
> See it here: http://www.versedaily.org/2008/mylives.shtml
>
> Congrats, Al.
>
> Best,
> Jeff Newberry
>
> --
> Blog: http://museoffireblog.blogspot.com
> Obama Myths: http://www.matthew25.org/paf/index.htm
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 08:17:51 EDT
> From: AlMaginnes at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Maginnes Daily
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <bf5.4284701d.360b89ef at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Thanks, Jeff. It was a nice surprise this morning.
>
>
>
> **************Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> calculators.
> (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:11:16 EDT
> From: Rsgwynn1 at cs.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <cf8.41b5aa67.360b9674 at cs.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> In a message dated 9/23/2008 9:46:06 PM Central Daylight
> Time,
> GrahamD at ripon.edu writes:
> >
> > For a classroom exercise, I'm looking for poems
> that reverse time. Not ones
> > that focus on memories, but ones that actually
> describe time being reversed,
> > like movies run backward, etc.
> >
> > Got any favorites?
> >
> >
> >
> Not a poem, but there's that great scene in
> Slaughterhouse Five where Billy
> watches a war documentary backwards. Also J. G.
> Ballard's story "Time of
> Passage." There's a poem by Robert Pack in the
> old Mark Strand anthology, but I
> can't find it now.
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:19:53 -0400
> From: "David Weinstock"
> <david.weinstock at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> &, Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <437b1e3a0809240619h31d10546r64aeb21f14f2559f at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> There's the old joke: what happens when you play a
> country music record
> backward?
>
> You get your wife back, you get your truck back, you get
> your job back, your
> get your dog back.
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:24:12 -0400
> From: "Judy Prince"
> <jbalizsprince at googlemail.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> &, Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <7db1d01b0809240624t2ab2aedai8b7352a8f192d6e6 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> or husband, as the case more often is...
> Judy
>
> 2008/9/24 David Weinstock <david.weinstock at gmail.com>
>
> > There's the old joke: what happens when you play a
> country music record
> > backward?
> >
> > You get your wife back, you get your truck back, you
> get your job back,
> > your get your dog back.
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:28:45 EDT
> From: Rsgwynn1 at cs.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <c72.3c2e2f40.360b9a8d at cs.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> In a message dated 9/24/2008 8:20:25 AM Central Daylight
> Time,
> david.weinstock at gmail.com writes:
> >
> > There's the old joke: what happens when you play a
> country music record
> > backward?
> >
> > You get your wife back, you get your truck back, you
> get your job back, your
> > get your dog back.
> >
> >
> Yeah, but you have to give your beer back too.
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 06:57:25 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Bernadette Geyer <berniegeyer at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News &
> Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <837373.70433.qm at web50409.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Martin Amis' book Time's Arrow comes to mind, but
> no poems. Sorry.
>
>
> --- On Wed, 9/24/08, Rsgwynn1 at cs.com
> <Rsgwynn1 at cs.com> wrote:
>
> From: Rsgwynn1 at cs.com <Rsgwynn1 at cs.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Date: Wednesday, September 24, 2008, 9:11 AM
>
>
> In a message dated 9/23/2008 9:46:06 PM Central Daylight
> Time, GrahamD at ripon.edu writes:
>
>
> For a classroom exercise, I'm looking for poems that
> reverse time. Not ones that focus on memories, but ones
> that actually describe time being reversed, like movies run
> backward, etc.
>
> Got any favorites?
>
>
>
> Not a poem, but there's that great scene in
> Slaughterhouse Five where Billy watches a war documentary
> backwards. Also J. G. Ballard's story "Time of
> Passage." There's a poem by Robert Pack in the
> old Mark Strand anthology, but I can't find it now.
> _______________________________________________
> New-Poetry mailing list
> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
>
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:57:46 -0400
> From: TheOldMole <Opus40-01 at opus40.org>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Maginnes Daily
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> & Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID: <48DA475A.3090403 at opus40.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I love this poem (narrative and all). Congrats, Al, not
> just on being
> recognized by Verse Daily, but on wonderful work.
>
> Jeff Newberry wrote:
> > Today, Verse Daily features a fine poem by our very
> own Al Maginnes.
> >
> > See it here:
> http://www.versedaily.org/2008/mylives.shtml
> >
> > Congrats, Al.
> >
> > Best,
> > Jeff Newberry
> >
> > --
> > Blog: http://museoffireblog.blogspot.com
> > Obama Myths: http://www.matthew25.org/paf/index.htm
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >
>
> --
> Tad Richards
> http://www.opus40.org/tadrichards/
> http://opusforty.blogspot.com/
>
> Don't forget to order your copy of FILM NOIR!
> http://stores.lulu.com/store.php?fAcctID=2712239
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:07:13 -0400
> From: "Jeff Newberry"
> <jeff.newberry at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> &, Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <731bb17a0809240707s745cc61bj653a41636ef581a3 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> You can have my beer when you pry it from my cold, dead
> hands!
>
> Jeff Newberry
>
> On Wed, Sep 24, 2008 at 9:28 AM, <Rsgwynn1 at cs.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Yeah, but you have to give your beer back too.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Blog: http://museoffireblog.blogspot.com
> Obama Myths: http://www.matthew25.org/paf/index.htm
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:08:16 -0500
> From: David Graham <grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Subject: [New-Poetry] Re:Maginnes Daily
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> & Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <1B6E5E38-F386-4D8A-98B8-930FE2525A7A at ripon.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Amen. Nice one, Al. By the way, there's a link on
> the Verse Daily
> info page to your blog, which seems to be a dead one.
>
> Is it true you have a blog? URL?
>
>
>
>
> ========================================
> David Graham
> grahamd at ripon.edu
>
> Home Page:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz
>
> Poetry Library:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/DGPoLibrary.html
> ==========================================
>
>
>
>
> On Sep 24, 2008, at 8:57 AM, TheOldMole wrote:
>
> > I love this poem (narrative and all). Congrats, Al,
> not just on
> > being recognized by Verse Daily, but on wonderful
> work.
> >
> > Jeff Newberry wrote:
> >> Today, Verse Daily features a fine poem by our
> very own Al Maginnes.
> >>
> >> See it here:
> http://www.versedaily.org/2008/mylives.shtml
> >>
> >> Congrats, Al.
> >> Best,
> >> Jeff Newberry
> >>
> >> --
> >> Blog: http://museoffireblog.blogspot.com
> >> Obama Myths:
> http://www.matthew25.org/paf/index.htm
> >>
> >>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> >> ---
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> New-Poetry mailing list
> >> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> >> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Tad Richards
> > http://www.opus40.org/tadrichards/
> > http://opusforty.blogspot.com/
> >
> > Don't forget to order your copy of FILM NOIR!
> > http://stores.lulu.com/store.php?fAcctID=2712239
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:38:42 EDT
> From: AlMaginnes at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Re:Maginnes Daily
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <d60.33ed1a74.360baaf2 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> No blog here. I'm not sure what that link is. Between
> teaching, chasing a
> two year old, trying to write and whatever else comes up in
> the course of a day,
> I don't have time to blog. Or even check my spelling
> very often.
>
>
>
> **************Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> calculators.
> (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:40:38 EDT
> From: AlMaginnes at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <c3d.4192354d.360bab66 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> There's a poem in Rodney Jones's second book that
> has some images of time
> running backwords. Can't remember the poem's title
> right now (or the title of
> his second book) but it's the first or second poem in
> the book.
>
>
>
> **************Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> calculators.
> (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:45:08 -0500
> From: Halvard Johnson <halvard at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Re: poetics is childish
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> & Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <F556D341-A9FD-4CF1-A071-3EC8CD5E9E1D at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed;
> delsp=yes
>
> Ah, the art work as shape-shifter. That's a concept I
> find intriguing. And when it comes to narrative
> nowadays, I get most of what I need from movies.
>
> Hal
>
> McCain / Palin -- Just say thanks but no thanks.
> They're a bridge to nowhere.
>
> Halvard Johnson
> ================
> halvard at earthlink.net
> halvard at gmail.com
> http://home.earthlink.net/~halvard/index.html
> http://entropyandme.blogspot.com
> http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com
> http://www.hamiltonstone.org
> http://home.earthlink.net/~halvard/vidalocabooks.html
>
>
>
> On Sep 24, 2008, at 5:17 AM, Roger Day wrote:
>
> > Lst night as I was perusing my art books, I began to
> pull away from
> > this reductionist view, to move towards a more
> connected view, the
> > artwork as a beast that moves across all genres, and
> instantiates
> > itself according to the context it finds itself in at
> the time. It
> > could appear in several genres. Or none.
> >
> > On 9/24/08, Roger Day <rog3r.day at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> Evolving from this, bearing in mind that poetry
> has to compete with
> >> other genres these days, I took Hirst's lead
> and wondered what was
> >> unique to Poetry? What distinguishs poetry from
> the other art-forms
> >> out there? This is my question.
> >>
> >> Poetry for me is a unique compression of sound,
> semantics and graphic
> >> (text). Take away one of those legs and it begins
> to fail.
> >>
> >>
> >> Roger
> >>
> >>
> >> On 9/23/08, Chris Stroffolino
> <cstroffo at earthlink.net> wrote:
> >>> Don't know which question you mean
> off-hand Roger,
> >>> but if you're asking about the history of
> narrative poetry,
> >>> I do understand why many say that the rise of
> the novel as a
> >>> separate genre
> >>> (to say nothing of other non-poetic narrative)
> definitely
> >>> coincided with a
> >>> lessening of narrative poetry.
> >>> The other, somewhat overlapping issue, is the
> rise of "free" (or
> >>> non-rhyming) verse...
> >>> If poetry no longer rhymes for most, and
> there's short stories and
> >>> even
> >>> short short stories, etc.,
> >>> it's understandable why many find
> "narrative poetry" an endangered
> >>> species...
> >>>
> >>> On Sep 22, 2008, at 1:43 PM, Roger Day wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> I agree with you. But I was also wondering
> what you might
> >>>> describe as
> >>>> poetry's unique point compared with
> other genres?
> >>>>
> >>>> Seeing as most of you are content to take
> pot-shots, rather than
> >>>> answer that question, here's Nick
> Laird's attempt at an answer:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2008/sep/20/poetry
> >>>>
> >>>> Roger
> >>>>
> >>>> On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 6:50 PM,
> <JforJames at aol.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> In a message dated 9/22/2008 7:36:30
> AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> >>>>> rog3r.day at gmail.com writes:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I'm contesting the question
> >>>>> as to what genre narrative is best
> suited to.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Photography made quite a few modes of
> painting redundant. Indeed,
> >>>>> Damien Hirst in praise of Gerhard
> Richter in the Guardian at the
> >>>>> weekend, said that all that is left to
> painting is it's surface.
> >>>>> And
> >>>>> that's a lot of painting to fall
> by the wayside.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To go on telling stories in poetry
> means something else once other
> >>>>> similar modes in other genres are up
> for comparison. In other
> >>>>> words,
> >>>>> what is unique about poetry? To me,
> it's the use of parameters to
> >>>>> pattern words across the page, most
> usefully done as a collage.
> >>>>> You
> >>>>> see, there are techniques other than
> narrative.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Roger, I don't know think I'll
> take my notions of art criticism
> >>>>> from
> >>> Damien
> >>>>> Hirst.
> >>>>> He certainly couldn't tell Richter
> anything about
> >>>>> painting...surface,
> >>>>> texture, content,
> >>>>> concept, or otherwise. Saying that all
> that is left painting is
> >>>>> surface,
> >>> is
> >>>>> as much saying
> >>>>> that the window to the universe is
> still there, waiting, open,
> >>>>> blank, a
> >>>>> plane in space ready for
> >>>>> anything.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There is a whole generation of
> photo-realists doing quite well
> >>>>> in art
> >>> world,
> >>>>> 100+ years
> >>>>> after the advent of photography. And,
> of course, lot of
> >>>>> photography is
> >>>>> completely abstract,
> >>>>> so the a mechanical means of image
> capture has become just another
> >>> medium.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't think poetry is
> necessarily the best genre for
> >>>>> narrative. It's
> >>> still
> >>>>> a very good
> >>>>> means for the 'telling scene',
> a view into or way of imaginatively
> >>> unfolding
> >>>>> a larger,
> >>>>> untold story.
> >>>>> Finnegan
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ________________________________
> >>>>> Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> >>>>> challenges?
> >>> Check
> >>>>> out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> >>>>> calculators.
> >>>>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> New-Poetry mailing list
> >>>>> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> >>>>>
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> >>>> "I began to warm and chill
> >>>> to objects and their fields"
> >>>> Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
> >>>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>>> New-Poetry mailing list
> >>>> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> >>>>
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>> New-Poetry mailing list
> >>> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> >>>
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> >> "I began to warm and chill
> >> to objects and their fields"
> >> Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> > "I began to warm and chill
> > to objects and their fields"
> > Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:50:31 -0500
> From: David Graham <grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Subject: [New-Poetry] Re: [Backwards poetry
> To: NewPoetry <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID: <C4FFBDE7.14BB1%grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Thanks, I think that book's around here somewhere,
> whatever it's called by
> what's his name (mutter mutter mutter)--geez, I'm
> getting tired of this
> middle aged memory. . . .
>
> I can't remember things I want to, but lately I've
> woken up most mornings
> with a song running through my head. This a.m. it was Eddy
> Arnold doing
> "Cattle Call."
>
> Hal! You remember that backwards poem of yours yet?
>
>
>
>
>
> On 9/24/08 9:40 AM, "AlMaginnes at aol.com"
> <AlMaginnes at aol.com> wrote:
>
> > There's a poem in Rodney Jones's second book
> that has some images of time
> > running backwords. Can't remember the poem's
> title right now (or the title of
> > his second book) but it's the first or second poem
> in the book.
> >
> >
>
>
> ====================================================
> David Graham
> grahamd at ripon.edu
> Home Page:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/About%20Me.html
>
> Poetry Library:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/DGPoLibrary.html
> ====================================================
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:57:38 EDT
> From: AlMaginnes at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Re: [Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <ca1.409462a9.360baf62 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Most of my books are in storage right now. Got to get them
> home one day.
>
>
>
>
>
> **************Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> calculators.
> (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 09:59:49 -0500
> From: Halvard Johnson <halvard at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: "NewPoetry: Contemporary Poetry News
> & Views"
> <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID:
> <D1A52DD5-0C1E-4D76-B2B2-E4433627D0E1 at earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> Well, this one involves some backwardsness:
>
> THE GRASSY KNOLL
>
> In my dream
> I am standing
> behind a white
> picket fence
> on a grassy knoll
> drawing a bead on
> a president
> in an open car.
> I get off two
> quick shots,
> see a head
> explode
> in a haze
> of red and
> gray, see
> the woman turn
> to scramble
> after bits of
> brain
> and skull,
> see, over
> my shoulder
> heads turning
> toward me, toward
> where I am hidden,
> see uniformed men
> running toward me.
> But then all the pictures
> run backwards toward
> where the car comes
> around the corner
> straight towards me
> where I stand on
> the grassy knoll
> sighting along
> the barrel of my
> rifle, seeing
> the head again, the
> smiling face, the shock
> of hair, feeling the warm
> steel of the trigger,
> hearing the cheers
> of the crowd, the
> voice in my head
> shouting, “Shoot!”
>
> --HJ
>
> fr. Guide to the Tokyo Subway
>
> McCain / Palin -- Just say thanks but no thanks.
> They're a bridge to nowhere.
>
> Halvard Johnson
> ================
> halvard at earthlink.net
> halvard at gmail.com
> http://home.earthlink.net/~halvard/index.html
> http://entropyandme.blogspot.com
> http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com
> http://www.hamiltonstone.org
> http://home.earthlink.net/~halvard/vidalocabooks.html
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:05:17 -0500
> From: David Graham <grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Subject: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: NewPoetry <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID: <C4FFC15D.14BB8%grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Is this the one?
>
> Remembering Fire
>
> Almost as though the eggs run and leap back into their
> shells
> And the shells seal behind them, and the willows call back
> their driftwood,
> And the oceans move predictably into deltas, into the
> hidden oubliettes in
> the sides of mountains,
>
> And all the emptied bottles are filled, and, flake by
> flake, the snow rises
> out of the coal piles,
> And the mothers cry out terribly as the children enter
> their bodies
> And the freeway to Birmingham is peeled off the scar tissue
> of fields,
>
> The way it occurs to me, the last thing first, never as in
> life,
> The unexpected rush, but this time I stand on the cold hill
> and watch
> Fire ripen from the seedbed of ashes, from the maze of
> tortured glass,
>
> Molten nails and hinges, the flames lift each plank into
> place
> And the walls resume their high standing, the many walls,
> and the rafters
> Float upward, the ceiling and roof, smoke ribbons into the
> wet cushions
>
> And my father hurries back through the front door with the
> box
> Of important papers, carrying as much as he can save,
> All of his deeds and policies, the clock, the few pieces of
> silver;
>
> He places me in the shape of my own body in the feather
> mattress
> And I go down into the soft wings, the mute and impalpable
> country
> Of sheep holding all of this back, drifting toward the
> unborn.
>
> --Rodney Jones. The Unborn, Atlantic Monthly Press, 1985.
>
>
>
> On 9/24/08 9:57 AM, "AlMaginnes at aol.com"
> <AlMaginnes at aol.com> wrote:
>
> > Most of my books are in storage right now. Got to get
> them home one day.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Looking for simple solutions to your real-life
> financial challenges? Check out
> > WalletPop for the latest news and information, tips
> and calculators
> >
> <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1209382257x1200540686/aol?redir=http:
> > //www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001> .
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > New-Poetry mailing list
> > New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> > http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
>
>
>
> ====================================================
> David Graham
> grahamd at ripon.edu
> Home Page:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/About%20Me.html
>
> Poetry Library:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/DGPoLibrary.html
> ====================================================
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 19
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 11:18:38 EDT
> From: AlMaginnes at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> Message-ID: <ca3.3f7e4847.360bb44e at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> That's it. Good work.
>
>
>
> **************Looking for simple solutions to your
> real-life financial
> challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and
> information, tips and
> calculators.
> (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:22:29 -0500
> From: David Graham <grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Subject: [New-Poetry] Backwards poetry
> To: NewPoetry <new-poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu>
> Message-ID: <C4FFC565.14BC1%grahamd at ripon.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Oh, we all get involved in backwardness sometimes, Hal!
>
> Thanks, everyone, for the backwards suggestions. Marvelous
> stuff, Tad &
> Hal. Also Rodney. . . .
>
> If anyone can think of any more such poems, I'm all
> ears. It's strange,
> when I cooked up this exercise I assumed I'd be able to
> think of dozens of
> contemporary poems that pull this little trick.
> Couldn't.
>
> Here's one of mine, though, an old one.
>
> Maharg Divad
>
>
>
> Boys Backward And Forward
>
> "You take the language, I'll keep the
> fur"
> --from a dream
>
> Let's roll this whole movie backwards
> and see swimmers sucked along feet first
> by their thrashing wakes, silly grins vanishing
> under inverted splashes, then feet and legs
> arcing up softly to the quivering board
> where they'll bounce a bit, then retreat, retreat.
> Where do they go, those glistening selves
> tanned and dripping with their yawning summers?
> Why are they climbing into cutoffs and T-shirts
> with such eager faces? Why would they scatter
> backwards down the driveway on wobbly bikes?
>
> Already the June leafage is draining away
> into paler shades of May and April.
> The last freak snowfall mushrooms over brown grass
> before fluttering upward. Soon we will reappear
> clumsy-legged among snowbanks, catching snowballs
> and disassembling them carefully back to our feet.
> We'll be just faces now, peering out
> from the hoods of our fur-lined parkas,
> and everyone will be busy swallowing
> cloud after cloud of indigestible words.
>
> --David Graham. Stutter Monk. Flume Press, 1986.
>
>
>
>
> On 9/24/08 9:59 AM, "Halvard Johnson"
> <halvard at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > Well, this one involves some backwardsness:
> >
> > THE GRASSY KNOLL
> >
> >
> > --HJ
> >
> > fr. Guide to the Tokyo Subway
> >
> >
>
>
> ====================================================
> David Graham
> grahamd at ripon.edu
> Home Page:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/About%20Me.html
>
> Poetry Library:
> http://web.mac.com/drjazz/iWeb/Site/DGPoLibrary.html
> ====================================================
>
>
>
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> New-Poetry mailing list
> New-Poetry at wiz.cath.vt.edu
> http://wiz.cath.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/new-poetry
>
>
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