[New-Poetry] bg's contra-genteel..

[Bob Grumman]

Chris Stroffolino wrote:
>
> there goes bg again, acting like he's open to a wide range of poetry, 
> but then I see your definition of contra-genteel is only of the 
> "bukowski's followers" ilk....
"Bukowski's followers" is a brief description in a post to New-Poetry, 
not a definition, Chris.
> it's okay to shock the bougie, i suppose, but the second it gets more 
> political, a la ginsberg, then suddenly BG is at least as conservative 
> and restrictive as wiman...
>
Note also, that I did not presume to name all the kinds of poetry I 
thought Wiman was ignoring.  Also, I go by technique, not subject 
matter, so would call Ginsberg neo-Whitmanesque, basically, and not at 
all otherstream. He was also occasionally what I'd call contra-genteel 
(and a lot of contra-genteel poets are as self-rightously leftwing in 
their poetry as any politics-before-art  advocate could want).  Finally, 
how would I become more "restrictive" than Wiman by overlooking or even 
opposing political poetry--if there is such a thing?  Wiman overlooks a 
lot more than one or two kinds of poetry.

--Bob G.