[New-Poetry] Visual poetry

[Roger Day]

To your first paragraph ... yes, no and maybe. Shouldn't you be
looking at the relationship between individual bits? That seems as
important if not more than the whole or the individual bits.

To your second paragraph, yes and no. Burroughs cut-up his own books.
So no. Cut-ups can find phrases you didn't intend.

To your third paragraph, I have tried writing a mash-up. Deliberately
taking other writers words and mixing it. I leave it as an exercise to
the reader to find out which poems I ripped off.

 When I grew strong to climb
over the high stone wall
the mind put on it's sword
like a Leviathan astert
till it's coil like a thistle' leafs
a labyrinth celled
and waxed pain

no more ballads in Eynhallow
the wind wanders like an old man who has lost his mind

or else I'm dreaming' deep and canna waukan
but it's a fell queer dream if this is so
a real hillside, the roar of rage
and the yell of hate
the barking of dogs, the howling of wolves.
Who tonight is paying
the old accustomed tax of common blood?
Iraq and Afghanistan, Belsen and Dachau.
Rotterdam, the Clyde and Prague,
Salah ed Dinal Ayyubi before a court
sharp sword Mathesons of Loch Lash
the hardy soldiers of the enemy
my brother the soldier


Roger


On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 11:41 PM,  <jforjames at aol.com> wrote:
> Wouldn't you say that in visual art that the collage elements, generally
> speaking, can still be individually recognized? Like a torn corner of sheet
> music, an swatch of ornate wallpaper, a train schedule, a flattened beer
> can, etc. In most art collages there is both the 'all-at-once' effect that
> Jim C mentioned, but also a very compelling draw to look closely at the
> elements themselves, to mentally isolate certain bits & pieces, even to the
> point of  'reading' the words (when words are part of a particular element.
>
> That may or may not be true in text cut-ups, particularly if you are using
> single words/half phrases from an obscure text. If you cut up a speech from
> Hamlet and rearrange the words/phrases, they're likely to retain some echo
> or familiarity. Not so much if the pieces come from page 4 of two-year
> old newspaper.
>
> In music you now have mashups, too...is there an analog in poetry?
> Finnegan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Day <rog3r.day at gmail.com>
> Sent: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 6:07 pm
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Visual poetry
>
> Collage in writing - to my limited understanding - is usually a
> disjoint set of phrases. Burroughs cut-ups, etc. Sound-sense not
> required, indeed, discouraged by it's very disjointedness. An
> anti-music if you will.
>
> Heading into the visual, into collage, vizpo begins to be
> indiscernible from collage. Indeed, looking at the work that started
> this thread, it is collage. Looked at from this angle, "visual poetry"
> begins to occupy a very tiny plinth, almost disappearing up it's own
> fundamental.
>
> Roger
>
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