[New-Poetry] Visual poetry

[Roger Day]

Collage in writing - to my limited understanding - is usually a
disjoint set of phrases. Burroughs cut-ups, etc. Sound-sense not
required, indeed, discouraged by it's very disjointedness. An
anti-music if you will.

Heading into the visual, into collage, vizpo begins to be
indiscernible from collage. Indeed, looking at the work that started
this thread, it is collage. Looked at from this angle, "visual poetry"
begins to occupy a very tiny plinth, almost disappearing up it's own
fundamental.

Roger

On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 10:33 PM,  <jforjames at aol.com> wrote:
> In writing, rather than a true 'collage' effect, the introduction of the
> found/grafted elements, works more like 'sampling' inserted or layered
> into musical recordings. It would be nice if multi-track hearing/reading
> were possible. Since it's not really, layering can quickly become
> illegible/garbled. (Sometimes a palimpsest effect is possible using
> contrasting inks or variable font sizes, but then you're tilting in vizpo).
> Which leaves insertion, and some sound/sense resonance with the text
> proceeding or following the inserted element.
> Finnegan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Day <rog3r.day at gmail.com>
> Sent: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 11:59 am
> Subject: Re: [New-Poetry] Visual poetry
>
> You're right about the Single Big Impressive Image, but all because
> collagists did not produce works as you describe doesn't mean you
> couldnt. As a possible prototype, the Bayeux tapestry is a large
> collage of instances sewn up as a single thread. Cy Twombly's large
> canvas scribblings, for example. I don't think Cy Twombly intended
> this to happen, but I don't think it matters. Seeing his canvases
> together does seem to make them a non-singular experience. You're
> right about literature though, however, the plastic arts are very
> plastic.
>
> I thought, once, that image and text were modal operations. Not so
> sure now. I tend to go from the image into the word, rather than the
> word into the image. Something like, the word being the image given
> fixed meaning.
>
> I hate boundaries.
>
> Roger
>
> On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 1:52 PM, James Cervantes
> <cervantes.james at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Experiential collages aside (my early college days were indeed collage),
>> the
>> collage used in writing cannot be of the same nature (or have the same
>> impact)  as that used in graphic arts, because in the graphic arts you are
>> seeing the collage all at once, which can't happen with an art form with a
>> linear, discursive format - it can't be all-at-once, though of course it
>> could be if you had 2 or more performance folk reading 2 or more different
>> pieces at the same time.
>>
>> Hard to approach the impact of Duchamp, Braque, Picasso, or Schwitters
>> with
>> a piece of writing, however.  Then there are Joseph Cornell's boxes, which
>> are a three-dimensional collage, as well as mixed media, another kind of
>> collage, I think.
>>
>> There's collage, and then there's collage.
>>
>> - Jim
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 4:03 AM, Roger Day <rog3r.day at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> aren't texts a graphic use of the desert collage?
>>>
>>> On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Bob Grumman <bobgrumman at nut-n-but.net>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Chris Lott wrote:
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 15:28, Bob Grumman <bobgrumman at nut-n-but.net>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Basinski is one of my Major Poets, and I love these three things of
>>> > his.
>>> >  I'm not sure I'd call them poems, though.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > I like 'em, though I usually see such things categorized as collage...
>>> >
>>> > c
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > We agree--although I'd have to see the things life-size to determine if
>>> > their texts fuse with their graphics enough to seem visual poems to me.
>>> >
>>> > --Bob G.
>>> >
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>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>
>
>
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-- 
My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
"I began to warm and chill
to objects and their fields"
Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds